لقاء طويل جدا مع Satoru Iwata ( من الانسادير )

IGNinsider: There is a big question we all want to know -- what does Jim Merrick do now?

Jim Merrick: The big secret. Well, I'm actually working very closely with Mr. Iwata on a network/Internet game strategy for Nintendo.

IGNinsider: Are you guys going to talk about your online strategy at all during E3?

Satoru Iwata: We think there is definitely a lot of use for online connectivity in creative games. One of the problems with the Internet world right now is that it costs money to connect, but afterwards, everything is free.

IGNinsider: Not everything. [pointing at ourselves]

[laughter]

Jim Merrick: Except for your site, of course.

Satoru Iwata: As we all know that's why the Internet has spread as fast and quickly and has grown as fast as it has. And there are certain niche markets within the Internet where people are paying and making money, such as things you have to do for your daily life. People pay for subscriptions or sites that help you find jobs. So one thing about the entertainment industry, it's not something that people need to survive. It's very difficult to create something that targets a wide audience and gets them to pay you every month. While it's easy to make money on the Internet by charging for a very short period of time, the biggest challenge is to create a sustainable system where you can have this set up, and operating over a long period of time it continues to be profitable. So to devise a system like that is the real challenge for us. That's been a big problem for many of the dotcom companies. They spent all of their money at the beginning thinking they have to go online, we have to be prepared for this network aspect, and they spent all of their money on marketing and made a little money over time -- but it just wasn't sustainable.

Satoru Iwata, director and general manager at Nintendo (Japan).

Right now, Jim and myself are working to figure out the best system that targets everyone from kids to adults in a way that gives them something while being sustainable over a long time. We're looking to do this in both the US and Japan.

IGNinsider: Is there anything you've learned from your experience with Randnet DD and the 64DD's networking abilities in Japan?

Satoru Iwata: Not just with the 64DD, but even going back to the 1980s, we've been challenging ourselves for a long time to come up with these systems and do use networks. One example is the system we had in the '80s with Nomura Shouken, a securities company, and also using satellites in Japan. We've since decided that initially we didn't do quite enough analyzing of how we'd be making this a sustainable system. And we're really trying to learn from these experiences.

But we're more interested in the big picture right now, where our games are heading. I've been working with Mr. Miyamoto for about 17 years, watching him even over at HAL and seeing how Mr. Miyamoto thinks. The one thing about Mr. Miyamoto -- obviously he is very creative -- but that's not his only strong points, it's not just that he comes up with innovations, but really he's able to analyze things and see the big picture as he goes about his game creation. He can see the direction he is moving in. He's really strong at analyzing people when he watches them play; where they're having fun, which parts of the games appeal to them, which don't appeal to them, where they're getting lost, when they're having trouble. He is able to see the moments when people put down the controller and say "that's enough." Or when people say "you've got to play this" and pass the controller to someone else. It's that big picture that we're interested in.

At our press conference we said that we don't really agree with the idea behind all of the sequels on a lot of the platforms. Somebody may say, "well, Nintendo's making sequels." But we don't really see those as sequels because, though they may have the same characters, they are different settings, different gameplay mechanics and things like that.

IGNinsider: Just to quickly get back to your online plans, we asked Sega how Phantasy Star Online would in fact go online and the company said to ask you. So can you elaborate?

How will Sega pull off the online aspects of Phantasy Star Online Version 2 on GameCube?

Iwata: [Laughter] Sega has come to us and said that we do want to go online – both in the US and Japan – and we are in discussions with the company about that. Unfortunately, the discussions haven't been finalized and they haven't been wrapped up. That's why, and we're really sorry, but we can't discuss our plans with Sega at E3 because if we go into it now before everything is finalized it's just going to confuse the matter.

Once those discussions are finalized, we do think that there will be something that happens as a result of that. So we think that probably by this later summer at Space World there will be a chance for us to make announcements with good timing, and we'll probably be giving more concrete examples of just how it's going to happen.

IGNinsider: 16-player Super Smash Bros. Melee?

[Laughter around the table]

Perrin Kaplan: Was it you guys that said you wanted to see the Ice Climbers in SSB?

IGNinsider: Yeah -- and we want to see Kid Icarus too.

Mr. Iwata can't be tricked into revealing more Smash Bros. characters.

Iwata: Yeah, we will have additional characters, but they're secret for now [laughs].

IGNinsider: How many GameCube projects is Miyamoto-san currently overseeing?

Iwata: In terms of what he has been working directly on, of course Luigi's Mansion, Pikmin, and although it's being developed in the United States at NST, he's also been fairly involved with the development of Wave Race. Beyond those three, if you include anything from suggestions to minor tests, you could say he's probably working on four to five at this time.

So we may be able to show some of those projects at Space World this summer. And others, which are most likely products for the next fiscal year, will probably be shown at E3 next year.

IGNinsider: Pikmin came out of nowhere and we love it. Are you holding back many more secrets for a Space World unveiling?

Iwata: I suppose Mr. Miyamoto and I have been in discussion to make sure we have sufficient impact at E3. And also, with Space World being what it is, and knowing that it needs to have its own impact, we do have things to say there that will hopefully have an impact.

IGNinsider: Can we expect new US software to show at Space World?

Iwata: Yeah, that may be possible. As you know the Space World show used to be for Japan whereas E3 was mainly for the US. Starting really last year with the GameCube announcement at Space World, though, that show really became a point for announcing to the world our plans. And this time at E3 we've kind of done the same thing -- it's been a worldwide announcement with worldwide news for all markets. We think that you'll probably see some more of that at Space World with announcements for the US and Eurpoe as well as Japan.

You can really say that over the last year there has been an increase in communication between Nintendo Japan and everybody else. It has probably been quite difficult for a lot of people responsible for getting the news out, but at the same time we think we've managed to please quite a lot of people.

IGNinsider: Miyamoto commented at E3 that we would possibly see Mario at Space World. Is that a hint of Mario in Luigi's Mansion or a brand new game for the Italian plumber?

Iwata: I think that Mr. Miyamoto's real intent with that comment was not a reference to Luigi's Mansion, but maybe a plan that he has for yet another Mario game.

IGNinsider: What was the idea behind changing the GameCube controller's B-button from its former kidney shape to a smaller, circular red?

The GameCube controller has undergone more changes (above).

Iwata: I'm frankly pretty surprised at the number of changes we've made to this controller [laughs]. I think that it really contains a lot of the DNA of Nintendo, if you will. And I think that Nintendo puts a lot more emphasis and uses the controller more than any of the other companies.

Obviously, when we make prototypes at Nintendo we then pass those along for everybody to comment on and give their input on. And as Mr. Miyamoto is known to do, he likes to continue to make his changes and maximize all the functions of the controller, even up to the very last minute at which point we've got our hardware people scrambling to get his changes in [laughs].

He's always making changes. Improving. So, actually if you notice that games that we've unveiled – especially Luigi and Pikmin – you'll see that they make a lot of use of the controller's c-stick and that is something that Mr. Miyamoto wanted to do. But he mentioned earlier that he's still not totally happy with the feel of the c-stick and he's still working on it and it will probably change again.

But the hardware team is intent that the one we're showing at E3 is the final one. But because Mr. Miyamoto has asked for this final change and we do want to get this in the final product, the hardware team is back at home working very hard to make sure that they get it done in time and from my opinion, it looks as though everything is going well. I think it's because of this perfectionist attitude that Mr. Miyamoto has and the kind of last minute changes he makes to improve the controller is part of the reason why people really feel that Nintendo controllers have the best feel and are very easy to use.

IGNinsider: We noticed that Nintendo released slightly modified specifications for the GameCube graphics chip and main CPU. Why?

Iwata-san explains the reasons for the Gamecube spec changes.

Iwata: I think this is going to require some explanation so let me make sure I say this properly [laughs].

Well, as we mentioned in our pre-E3 conference, the GameCube is an optimized machine for gaming and really what we've tried to do is eliminate all the bottlenecks in the processing system so that the games will run smoother. And actually the graphics chip went so well for us that it was able to do more than we had originally expected. Because of this, we found that the CPU was unable to process things as quickly as we had originally anticipated.

So, just as Mr. Miyamoto changed the controller at the last minute, we felt that we had really tried to optimize this machine and remove all the bottlenecks so we needed to make sure that what we finally put out there truly is optimized. And so really focusing on a really balanced machine – everything from price to performance, we've had a lot of discussions and came to a final decision that the spec we just released is the best one.

Actually, we've been in discussion with both the EAD development teams, the Super Smash Bros. Melee team at Hal, development teams at Rare – we've talked to them, gotten their opinions and they all feel that this new spec is more balanced and they feel that it's going to be better for them to work with.

So it is not bad news [laughs].

IGNinsider: What can you tell us about GameCube Pokemon?

Iwata: Well, we first showed you the demo at Space World last year and a lot of people were wondering why we didn't show something here at E3. But really what this E3 show is about is that we've focused on games that we're going to have out by the end of this year and that game is not going to be one of them, which is why we haven't shown it here.

Above: Meowth's Party, the Pokemon demo shown off at Spaceworld 2000.

One other aspect is that we're also currently in development with Pokemon for Game Boy Advance and we're working on getting a really good link between those two games.

Of course, we could do something like we have with Pokemon Stadium in the past, but if we do something like that it wouldn't be as much fun as it's already been done. So instead we're looking at things that haven't been done and we're looking at new things to add to them and new ways to get the two games to work together so that we can create something that's going to make people happy. If we don't try hard enough we're going to end up with a sequel that's not going to please people.

IGNinsider: Can we expect to see Zelda at Space World? New footage?

Iwata: At this point unfortunately I cannot comment on whether it will or won't as the decision just hasn't been made yet. But development is continuing on that game, the question is just a matter of timing. We don't know if it will be Space World or not, but there will be an announcement on it at some point.

IGNinsider: How does Nintendo decide which second-parties to hand off specific franchises to?

Iwata: Me and Mr. Miyamoto decide after much discussion [laughs].

In the case of Super Smash Bros., that was actually a conversation that was brought up by Hal with Nintendo. That was, of course, back when I was still with HAL and as a longtime partner of Nintendo, we thought that such a game would be a plus for both sides.

Metroid Prime (above: artwork) is being developed by US-based Retro Studios.

In the case of games like Metroid and Wave Race for GameCube, those were actually conversations brought up by NCL. They thought it would be a great way to get more games out there and establish franchises. On the other hand, in the case of Star Fox Adventures, rather than one side bringing it to the other, it just kind of naturally evolved into the game after discussions on both sides. We've been working with Rare for a long time and it was just a matter of our hearts coming together.

IGNinsider: We were very surprised to see that Capcom was behind the recent Game Boy Zelda titles. Is that a hint of a closer relationship between Nintendo and Capcom in the future?

Iwata: In the case of Capcom, we just felt that the team that was doing development on that was really suited to doing a Zelda game on Game Boy. It wasn't to be taken as an indication of something very special between Nintendo and Capcom, it was more of an indication of a relationship between Mr. Miyamoto and that particular Capcom team – and they've built some trust there with that.

Obviously, with the teams that we have within Nintendo, if all that we're doing is making new updates to our franchise character games then those teams are going to be too busy to create anything new and innovative. So it really helps us out to be able to farm some projects out so that our own teams can work on creating something new. So, if we were take something like Metroid and Wave Race and develop them in-house, we wouldn't have Pikmin here to show you today.

IGNinsider: So we can put the rumor to rest that Nintendo is interested in acquiring Capcom?

Iwata: That is absolutely not going to happen. It's not part of our culture to even think about outright purchasing a third-party developer.

IGNinsider: Speaking of Microsoft...

[Laughter around the table]

Satoru Iwata on Nintendo's philosphy.

Iwata: Our philosophy really is that if you do buy a third-party company, if the people then leave that company your talent is gone. You don't have that anymore. In the same way, if you buy a license you have that exclusivity period, but who knows what's going to happen after that? Really, the most recent example of that was Crash Bandicoot. That game was marketed and generated a lot of popularity and did really well, and then the exclusivity ended. It's not [Sony's] anymore. So it's not something that we really want to be doing.

IGNinsider: How would you say Nintendo's philosophy is different from Microsoft's?

Iwata: We have been in the entertainment business for a long time and we've learned a lot about when and how to invest our money. With Microsoft, they just haven't been in the entertainment business that long so they're not as familiar with and don't have the experience that we do.

What really showed me that they don't have the experience in the entertainment industry is that they started off by announcing the $500 million marketing amount. So that's what they're going to go with and that's a big number and of course it's great because it got them in the news. But our philosophy is that you don't start off with a number of what you're going to market something with. Rather, you look at the product, you look at the entertainment and what you're trying to package and what you want it to be. Then you think about the best way to convey that to the consumer. That's what entertainment is about and that's why we don't go in for those types of tactics. If you come up with a product that people don't want, it doesn't matter how much money you spend – they're still not going to want it.

We don't necessarily agree with how they've gone about doing things so far and don't think it's for us.

IGNinsider: What's your role at NCL now and how do you see it changing in the future?

Iwata: My primary role at NCL is to act as a communicator and to try and remove any frictions in communications based on my experience as a developer. Someone called me Director of Problem Solving.

IGNinsider: Do you think you'll be doing this for awhile or can you see your role changing within the next couple of months?

Iwata: Just in the last year with my move to Nintendo, things have changed so much for me that it's gotten to the point where I can't foresee what's going to happen next. But I'm having fun.

IGNinsider: We know that, for example, both Namco and Capcom have GameCube products in the works, but they weren't previewed at E3. Is this a Nintendo enforced strategy?

Iwata: It's really been their decision. I'm not sure, but really I think that maybe they felt it wasn't the right time to announce those games, or maybe they are first focusing on other games. But that's just really a guess.

Will EarthBound ever return?

IGNinsider: A lot of our readers ask about Earthbound 64. We know that it was cancelled, but are there any plans to revive it on GameCube or Game Boy Advance?

Iwata: There was a time when I was directly involved in working on the original Mother and Mother 2, which is Earthbound in the US. But I'm not in a position where I can do that anymore and until somebody comes in that can fill that role, I don't know if it can happen or not. And Earthbound 64 is really the type of game that needs a lot of people to come together, not just one, to get everything to work. So, at this point I don't know whether or not it's something that can be done at HAL, or somewhere else, or what. But it is a game that has a lot of fans and whether or not there will be something that comes of that on the GameCube or Game Boy Advance, I do think it would be good and I'd be happy to see that happen.

IGNinsider: Thanks for the interview.